Well, since http://cemetech.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2181&highlight= is locked for no apparant reason, I figured I'd make a new thread so I can actually respond

Chip, that case is easily worth $150-200, very nice indeed.

That RAM is corsair XMS PRO series w/ activity LEDs ~$50 per stick ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145053 ) And it appears to be DDR, not DDR2

Motherboard: First impression, its a POS. I noticed the VIA chipset, which means its definitely a budget board

CPU: Take off that HSF already

PSU: Take a nice, close-up pic of the spec sheet on the side (where it lists the amps on each rail)

So have you tried firing it up yet? Does it work?

Yea, can a mod help us out here?

Haven't tried yet. I will though when I get a chance.

I'll take more pics later today hopefully. Too bad about the mobo. How much would a better model cost me?

Well, you need to find out what kind of proc you have, first.

If that is DDR I see, and not DDR2, then you are looking at either a Celeron D/M or a Pentium 4/D/M (socket 478), which means you are pretty well stuck with AGP and [old] motherboards. But hey, for a near-free system, it ain't bad

That looks to me like a LGA775 stock cooler, not 478.

478 (P4 1.6 ghz)

775 (Celeron 2.5 ghz)

yes, you are right, my bad

Chip, your motherboard is a BIOSTAR PT880 Pro-A7C Socket T (LGA 775) VIA PT880 PRO ATX Intel Motherboard ($55 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813138275 ) and it has both an AGP slot and a PCI-E x16 slot. But its still a POS

That means the RAM is XMS2 Pro series (DDR2)

A new, better motherboard will run anywhere from $150 to $250, depending on how new and better you want to get (see "foamy's new computer" thread for some ideas)

The CPU can then be anything from a 2.5ghz Celeron D ($47 POS) to a Core 2 Extreme Quad-Core kentsfield ($1,100)

The threads called "motherboard stuff"
http://www.cemetech.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1970

Thaanks.. that Celeron I pictured is in my primary system.
Just more evidence that I urgently need to get an E6300.

Oh, boy. It all comes down to this...

I'm willing to spend anywhere from 200-500 on new parts for this computer. After I figure out exactly where I stand with it, I will definitely like to here some suggestions on what to get. I might be getting some equipment tomorrow, so I'll hold off until then before I start seriously looking into parts.

Ok, from what I can determine after taking it apart here are the updated stats:

Mobo: Nothing new from me, perhaps one of my new pictures will help confirm.

Ram: It appears that it is XMS2 Pro series (DDR2).

Processor: The chip reads:

Disk Drive: Yay, I got a dvd burner!

Random PCI Card: Indeed a sound card. Specifically a Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS (Model SB0350)

Hard Drive: Man this think is going to be hard to take out, and it's in there so well. I think I'll just leave it and see what I have in terms of space when I finally get this thing up and running. Unless there's a possibility it could be incompatible? My friend did say something about the bios not detecting it. I've never heard of a harddrive being incompatible (other than it not being the right type like IDE or SATA).

Other devices: Eh, does anything else matter? (I'm not being sarcastic here).

Ok, more pics:

Looks like you've got a P4 531 - extremely hot, not much room for overclocking, but it should perform reasonably. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819116230
I don't know about the RAM, but Corsair's XMS has a very good reputation.
That optical drive should be fine.
HD appears to be SATA, it should be fine, depending on the capacity.
Sound card is fine.

So.. things you still need:
Go with your old graphics card until DX10 becomes widespread, or get a cheapo DX9 one for now.
Monitor: you can get a 19'' LCD with decent latency for ~200 bucks
Keyboard: eh, dig something up.

If you wanted to upgrade internals then, I'd tell you to go ahead and get a new mobo and a Core 2 Duo processor (totalling about $400 for a good combination.

Chip: I already said what motherboard that is, and linked to its newegg page

P4s == horrible

The ram is quite good actually, high-end stuff.

That Audigy 2 is pretty good though - excellent sound

So here's what you should get. New motherboard (determined by how much you are willing to spend mainly, but figure around $200-$250 for a really good one, and $150 for a decent one), CPU (core 2 duo's start at under $200), and video card (7600GT is about $130 - good performance for the money)

Alright. Well then, time to figure out exactly what to get. Here's where I stand:

Budget: $600
I'm flexible here, but I'd like to keep it under $600.

Monitor: $0-$50
I got a tv for christmas. I'm pretty sure I can hook this up to the computer somehow (with the added expense of the cables and converters and whatnot), but I have to make sure I get a graphics card that can handle this. The price of the cables, converters, etc that I need for this will have to be

Keyboard and Mouse: $0
Got a wireless keyboard and mouse for christmas. No problems here.

Motherboard: $100-$200
From what you guys have said, I probably need an upgrade. First off, why is it a POS? Why should I get a new one? Would it be wiser to put money towards other parts of the computer instead?

I assume that I will need to replace it. In that case, with the current budget I think we're looking at something in the $100-$200 range.

Processor: $100-$200
I guess this has to go. I was really hoping it'd be a core duo. Ok, so if I don't get a new motherboard, what are my choices with my current socket for a new processor?

If I do get a new motherboard (which I think is way more likely), what should I go for? Core Duo? Athalon? I wouldn't mind an intel, but I've always been more of an AMD guy. I'll take whatever is the best in the price range of: $100-$200.

Graphics Card: $100-$200
I heard from this same friend that his dad might want to make another deal with me where "I get a $800 graphics card for $150." According to him, this is a nvidia geforce 6800 ultra. It's PCI-E, and has two div outputs. Should I look into this further, or are there better deals out there? I'm looking to spend another $100-$200. Remember, I need this to support my tv.

Nic Card: $10-$30
I'm going to need some sort of network card. Let's make this cheap. I have a linksys wireless g router providing wireless network in my house if that matters.

Ram: $0

Let's make sure that this new mobo supports my ram. From what you guys have said, it's worth holding on to.

Speakers:

If I can get this hooked up through my tv, I can have sound output through it as well, right? Let's keep this in mind.

Total estimated Cost: $310-$680

-----------------------

Other specific needs:

*I'd like this computer to be able to interface with my old printer.
*I think I'm going to use my very old floppy drive in this computer. What the hell, ya know?
*I have an old Maxtor hdd (10 gig). I might as well use this too if I can.
*I have an old cd burner, and cd rom drive. These can see use if it's practical.
*I have an old mother board. Ancient in fact. I think I'll use this to practice on so that I don't mess any thing up when it comes to dealing with the real thing.
*I have lots of IDE cabling, screws, assorted cables and connectors, converters, and routers, mice and mouse padds. All of these can see use if necessary.

-----------------------

Ok, here's what I have to work with from my home computer supply (these parts are from old scrap computers). Keep in mind, I think alot of this stuff predates PCI slots:

Old Printer:



Some sort of old network card. Appears to be dialup:


Ancient Sound Card:


This is the card that enabled my old printer to be hooked into the computer:


Old vid car (might be of use temporarily before new video card comes):


Old Mobo for practice:


Processor and socket:



Ram:


Hard drives, disk drives, floppy drives, and sound devices:

6800 Ultra is nowhere near being an $800 card - it was only ~$400 when it came out.... 2 years ago

7600GT is the way to go ($140) - performance is basically identical to the 6800 Ultra (haha, $800, what a joke), but it should use less power and has the newer architecture. So given the choice between a 7600GT and a 6800Ultra for the same price, go with the 7600GT every time

Motherboard: It has a poor chipset, meaning it might not support newer CPUs, is slower, and doesn't have all the cool new features a new chipset will have.

Your SOCKET is compatible will every new intel CPU on the market (including the core 2 quad), but that doesn't mean your motherboard will work with them (see above)

NIC Card: Who the hell still BUYS these things? You can get dual GigE ports built into the motherboard now (1xGigE is basically standard), why would you need a nic card???

RAM: its DDR2, all new intel CPUs are using DDR2 - it'll work

Monitor: Here's where it gets a *bit* tricky. Is your new TV an HDTV? If not, its gonna be ugly, as its only roughly 640x480 resolution then. If it *is* HDTV, check to see if it has an HDMI connector. If so, a simple DVI<->HDMI cable is all you need ($25). Either way, text won't be as readable as on a "real" monitor

SO lets price this out

CPU Core 2 Duo 1.86 ghz retail - $190 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819115005 ) - next CPU up is 2.13ghz for $220, might be worth the upgrade ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819115004 )

Motherboard ASUS P5W Delux - $230 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131025 ) - this sucker is tricked out. Dual-GigE ports, built in wifi B/G, you name it, this thing has it. 6 SATA ports, and still has 2 IDE connectors (for up to 4 devices, of course). Of course, don't forget the built in 7.1 surround sound and SPDIF and Optical outs. Includes a Media remote - should work great with that TV (now do you see why the mobo you got is a POS?) - the catch? No parallel port, so you can't use it with your old printer. I think they make parallel port -> USB adapters though, but I'm not certain

Video Card EVGA 7600GT - $140 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814130017 ) includes TV out (HDTV Component, S-Video, and Composite)

TV Tuner KWORLD ATSC-110 (HDTV support) $70 ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815100140 ) - hey, if you are hooking it up to a TV, you might as well have it function as a DVR

Cost: $630-660 (depending on which CPU you pick)

Ok, I'll tell him that I'll pass on the graphics card.

Ok, that's enough reason for me.

Ok, I have about the knowledge of a five year old when it comes to this stuff. I know the basics, but I'm not familiar with newer stuff, and I'm bound to make stupid assumptions. I still need some way to get into my wireless network. Would an ethernet bridge or some sort of card be better at this? Or is even this feature built in? Remember this is a linksys wireless g network.

Ok, so no matter what Mobo I get it will work as long as I keep with intel. Easy enough.

Argh, I don't think I have a HDTV. It's a Memorex MT2024. This needs to be factored in below with the tuner and mobo, right?

Should I be concerned that my current processor is 3ghz and these are way lower. Does the dual core make up for that? Are you sure it's worth the money? Here's my train of though:

Core 2 Duo 1.86 ghz @ $190, so total of 3.72ghz
P4 3ghz @ $0, so total of 3 ghz
difference: .72 ghz @ $190

There has to be more to this. Assuming that it's worth it, is it really worth another $30 to me to get .27 ghz? Can you give me an example with speed in games where this would be a factor, or another example?

I almost pissed my pants when I read this. :drools:

Oh, and what of my awesome sound card? Is that of no use now that this comes with built in surround sound?

Will this fit in my case?

Awesome, awesome. Unfortunately, I don't have an HDTV according to what I have read. The tv does have S-Video input.

Oh, hells yea! I just have to make sure that I'm actually getting cable in my room first (as that hasn't been guaranteed). And also will the non-HDTVness of my tv be a factor here?

You're breakin my balls, but I have to say this computer is going to be amazing. I'm all over this. I just need to hash out a few remaining details.

Ok, so factoring in what I found out with the tv, where do we stand?

Remember the CPU are of different microarchitexture. Just like a TI-89 will spank a TI-83 even though they are close in terms of megahertz

gigahertz don't mean crap EXCEPT when comparing identical architectures (eg, a P4 at 3ghz is faster than a P4 at 2.8ghz, and an Athlon64 at 2.2ghz is faster than an Athlon64 at 2.0ghz, but the Athlon64 at 2.2ghz is probably faster than the P4 at 3ghz) So EACH OF THE TWO CORES in the Core 2 Duo will destroy your P4, no competition

NIC Card: The motherboard I picked out has 2 Ethernet ports and built in wifi (b and g), no need for a seperate card, regardless of whether you are using wired or wireless, the motherboard has it built in

The TV being HDTV or not is purely going to be how it looks to you. Everything I picked out will work equally well with a non-HDTV, just that its going to be lower resolution. The TV tuner is a dual HDTV and non-HDTV tuner, and I think it can tune cable signals also.

Er, what awesome sound card? That POS in the pictures looks like it'll put out sound quality on par with a SNES

Ok, cool. I get it.

Most awesome.

Alright. Cool.

The Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS I got with the computer not the pos that I scrapped from my old computer.


So let me make a final list of parts. I'll also need to buy other small things like cables and thermal paste, etc, right?
Motherboard: ASUS P5W Delux $230
*http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813131025

Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo @ 1.86 Ghz $190
*http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819115005

Video Card: EVGA 7600GT $140
*http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814130017

TV Tuner: KWORLD ATSC-110 $70
*http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16815100140

So this is going to cost me around $630 minus rebates (looking like $35) plus shipping (hey maybe I can get that free).

Edit: Oh, and are we sure that this will not only all work together, but that this will fit in my case? I've been warned in the past that not all mobo's fit in all cases.

Edit2: I might just be being paranoid, but are we sure that my power supply will work with this new mobo?

Case = ATX, mobo = ATX, PSU = ATX; it'll all work fine.

Alright. Pending parental and Kllrnohjian approval, I will be ordering these parts either later tonight or tomorrow.

Possibly a hitch: Could this be a problem?

Chip: Thats everything you need. The CPU is a retail one, and comes with a HSF w/ pre-applied thermal paste. Motherboard comes with craploads of cables. The only one you will need is from the video card to the TV

The Audigy 2 ZS will sound much better than the onboard, so go with that (not that that will change my motherboard choice - they almost all come with 5.1 or 7.1 surround sound anyway )

Just give me a nice, close-up (and readable) picture of the PSU label, please, so that I can check if you need the 20+4->24 pin adapter

Just a suggestion, but for $30 more, the extra 300 mhz might be worth it... (your call, of course, but just a thought)